Is it generally an accepted practice to tax the churches in your campa

[Lawgiver]

Survey #234

[Arch-Sorcerer Gargamel]

I play it based on my regent. I'm playing the regent of Rzhlev in a campaign now, and I don't plan on taxing my church because the priest of the land is my vassal, so I get regency and gold from him anyways.

My general rule is, if they are of a different faith than I, I tax to the full extent of my power. If they are of the same faith, I don't tax and consider that my donations to the church.

[Riegan Swordwraith]

Hmmmmmm......One must be careful when it comes to the church,regardless to whom it may belong.One would be handicapping himself if he(or she as the case may be) just allowed ANY power to operate within his domain without making sure some kind of deal,whether it be GB's,defense,access to Realm Spells,etc.

[Lord Eldred]

It is taboo to tax the Rightful church of Haelyn in the United Provinces of Haelyn. Any other church is fair game!

[Bryon]

I would have to say that in most of the realms I play in I tax the church if it is not the state religion. Usually the church tends to try to make it self needed by the regent and give help anyhow.

[Lord Eldred]

Exactly my point!

[Lawgiver]

I could stand to second (or third as the case may be) that motion. Since there are only two primary faiths (though others exist) in my campaign, its pretty much one or the other as the realm's official religion.

[Lord Eldred]

Yes I seem to recall that you have adapted the religions of Earth into your Birthright campaign. Why only two of them?

[Lawgiver]

I'm basing it on the start of the Reformation period. There was largely only one recognized by the state until Martin Luther and Erastus.

Plus the central powers of faith allow for a better push over of arrogant regents. They seek to play the regents off on each other, because the church is in control without an emporer. ;)

[Lord Eldred]

And what about non-recognized religions? Do they exist as cults or not at all?

[Lawgiver]

I actually have other religions. The Khinasi are large Muslim. THere is Hindu, Paganism, Satanism, Toaism, etc. For the most part though these are not practiced in the open in Anuire. I have used Cult activity as adventure hooks and means for the church to complain to the regent several times. The use of more centralized churches as also helped the players. They don't have to familiarize themselves with the countless dieties presented in the campaign. They are more familiar with the religions of present/historical times.
It actually poses quite an interesting mix.

[Lord Eldred]

When I was in 7th grade (a long time ago) I had to do what you did with the campaign and have only the major religions of the world otherwise many parents of the people I played with would not allow them to play because they believed the game was the tool of the devil because the existence of pagan gods and demons!

[Temujin]

Normally, I don't tax the churches, except if I don't like them. However I have this habit of changing how I play with each character(or at least trying to!), so I've been known to do things like playing "King of England style"... In a game where I had three religions in my realm, I pretended to be above the High Priestesses's in the church hierarchy(the three of them, no less, lol). I generally cooperate with the church though, since I nearly were excommuniated in a game for being opposed to the Holy Inquisition, eheheh :P

[Lord Eldred]

It would have been worth being excommunicated rather than being in support of the Holy Inquisition. It is movement like those that cause wars like the one the U.S. is in now!

[brownie]

Dont tax them if they pay tribute. If they are willing to bend over backwards with magic and rp then let them be. If you have more religions then you are just more diversified kinda like the US.lol

[Green Knight]

Large, powerful temples like the OIT can generally avoid being taxed entirely. Some other temples get to pay at a reduced rate, but most have to accept taxation. It all comes down to diplomacy :)

[centAUr]

Just play an Elven kindom and you won't need to bother with clerics ;)

Ok, let's get serious. It is a good think to keep Priests happy since they are created to make rebelions(apart from realm spells). A happy priest can be great help, but the best is a vassal priest(and stupid enough to be happy for that). But if the realm has economical problems they should pay too. If they do it through tributes better, if they don't then tax them as much as possible. On the other hand a trade service(as per book of regency) can do the job and keep them all happy. Everything can be done better with diplomacy.

Anyway, PUT THEM TAXES, after all they earn money for doing nothing but rebelions and contesting each other :P
Or better expell them, as by the elven customs(elves are definetly more advanced).

[Strahd]

Orginally posted by centAUr
Anyway, PUT THEM TAXES, after all they earn money for doing nothing but rebelions and contesting each other :P
Or better expell them, as by the elven customs(elves are definetly more advanced).
Funny thing that the more advanced lost because they lacked priestly magic.

[Rhobher Nichaleir]

I 'suggest' that the church raise a unit or two and place them at my disposal. Taxing churches is unseemly.

[Lord Eldred]

IF we accept some of the arguments made here we better not tax magic users because we would want to piss them off. Don't tax any generals or anyone that could muster armies either because that could cause us trouble. Where are we to get the money then, the people, I don't think so they might go into rebellion!

[Arch-Sorcerer Gargamel]

So just tax the guilders, they can't do too much about it, and they make the most money (or should) anyways.

[Riegan Swordwraith]

Yeah tax the guilders.....they can only sell you out to your enemies and/or destroy your economy,that way you can't make anything.

If you are the High Lord of a Domain,be it a King,Duchess,or Baron,you should tax,work out a deal of support,whatever you can do.They are there on YOUR good graces,and they may be powerful,but in your realm you are the top dog.If in order to exercise your rights as regent you need strength,do it.Make the deals you need to.Contest the temples if you have to then allow another temple to fill in the void.

[Lord Eldred]

Riegan, you forgot the ability to afford large number of mercenary armies to defeat you with!

[Riegan Swordwraith]

If your temple really wants to be that power hungry go ahead.Most temples cover more than one land,and as the regent if you feel a showdown is coming,make sure thos countries that share those temples would be ready to fight too.Temples may be strong,but against several lands even they will lose.If nothing else that Temple will be weakened to the point of another temple being allowed to move in.

Lord Eldred,are you telling me,that if I,(just setting up a scenario),as King of a nation,was to come to you,as head of your Temple to Haelyn,and request say,4 GB each season for purposes of domain maintenance and expenses,I am out of line???I came to my throne through legal means,ie I was the heir who was invested when the old King died,I am a good man and the people love me.I did not come demanding it,I came asking.I was polite and respectful.But by your and many others words,I am an infidel because I dared ask the church to pay a tax???

[Strahd]

...but it is not always to your interest. I.e. it is much more preferrable not to tax the Cuiracean church in your domain, but in return ask that they defend with their troops your territories. They might be offended if you ask 1 GBs, but be glad to pay much more to maintain a military who will constantly defend your lands.

[Lord Eldred]

In my realm the church and state very often share wealth for the purpose of advancing the position of both. I was actually agreeing with you that taxing the guilds only is a problem. They could use their vast fortunes if they get pissed off to hire armies to overthrow you as province regent. Politics is like walking it tight rope. One false move and you will fall to your death.

[Riegan Swordwraith]

Ahhhhhh.....hehe...I feel like a horses arse!!!!

Sorry 'bout that Lord Eldred...

[centAUr]

Orginally posted by Strahd

...but it is not always to your interest. I.e. it is much more preferrable not to tax the Cuiracean church in your domain, but in return ask that they defend with their troops your territories. They might be offended if you ask 1 GBs, but be glad to pay much more to maintain a military who will constantly defend your lands.



Yes, allow them to raise armys and maintain them in your domain and when attacked by your neighboors that have us their main religion the Cuiracean too who are they going to support? We don't you give them the law of the land too?

The only one with armys in your domain should be YOU.
OK. You should be careful with churches by with guilds too. You should charge them something reasonable and definately not let them be the only church or guild in your domain. When their stay is contested by a rival, they will be happy to give money in order to earn your neutrality!!!!

As far as guilds are concerned, apart from selling information to your rivals and use their vast fortunes against you, they can always assasinate you :P, if you piss them off.

[Lord Eldred]

Orginally posted by Riegan Swordwraith

Ahhhhhh.....hehe...I feel like a horses arse!!!!

Sorry 'bout that Lord Eldred...

We all make mistakes! You are forgiven ;)