Active PBEMS, new pbems?

[Mojczak]

Are there active PBEMS looking for players and which aren't mainly sitting idle? Would anyone here be interested to flesh out something with me and share DM chores? Like, a full 3.5 Birthright game. Doesn't need to be full continent or region scale. Could be something like 2 or 3 realms with all occupied regents. Something sweet and deviant.

[Thelandrin]

Ericthecleric's Shadows of Empire is still running and I believe a couple of others are. I'm afraid I can't commit to any GMing.

[Mojczak]

I'm afraid I can't commit to any GMing.

Oh please DO!!! I don't mind doing most of the work... I just need good support/initiation. As I lack definitive knowledge of PBEM dming. (thus why the relatively small scale). We shall make this wonderful and mind-blowing!!!

Seriously, Birthright needs a relive cure or something. We should have a promoting campaign on campuses for geeks :P. Make pbems flourish again.. :'(. Could be nice to make a "interested players", "potential dms" database for birthright pbems.

[Thelandrin]

Well, I might be able to commit to running a couple of low-maintenance NPC realms for you and maybe answering a few setting/theme questions, but I really can't commit to running a game :(

Regarding the database, we do have this sub-forum for that very idea, so it's really up to the posters to proceed as they wish.

[Mojczak]

What would you say if we took the heartlands and the east coast as a focus? (i.e., Ghoere, Elinie, Osoerde, Coeranys, Diemed, Aerenwe, Roesone, Medoere, Ilien as realm with playable regent), leaving regents from Ghoere, Aerenwe, Osoerde and Diemed as NPCs. Of even smaller scale. Ghoere, Elinie, Coeranys and Osoerde, but with the introduction of manor and similar holdings and numerous smaller lords.

[Thelandrin]

In a PBEM game of rulers, I don't think that the manorial style is terribly rewarding. (I'm sure that Kenneth will spring to disagree!) I would leave sub-realm politics and adventuring to face-to-face games and stick with realm play for PBEMs.

[Mojczak]

Well, I like the depth they actually had to the design of provinces and the multiplications of potential regents. After all provinces of 10 represents organized cities, but nones speaks of the country side. We could possibly design something different for manor than pure numeral (like, set a maximum number of manors per type of provinces and have them developped on their own as smaller sub-provinces with law, guild, and some other types of holdings). Like that, you could have a relatively developped country side with low province level - we just should find a way to balance that with sources and I think that'd be nifty and would allow for a smaller-range play with more focused intrigues (which eases the DMing while leaving the bookeeping at a seemginly identical level)

Edit. Wait. That's absurd. But there should be a way to allow smaller vassal regents to enter into play... hmmm.... possibly some unblooded as well.

[Mojczak]

COME ON, people. What is the reason why you keep coming on these forums. I'd say: Let's make one unforgettable pbem of all times! Let's recruit players, dms and fans, let's do this stuff, build dynasties, stories, adventures... Let's try to make a game that will be remembered for 10 years after!!!

[kgauck]

In a PBEM game of rulers, I don't think that the manorial style is terribly rewarding. (I'm sure that Kenneth will spring to disagree!)

You'd want somewhere on the order of 50 players to want to open up sub-domains.

Or limit the area to say - Alamie vs Tournen

Generally a game should either focus on the sub-domains or the domains. Who wants to sign up to be 1/10th as strong as the next guy? Setting up a PBeM with 50-80 players and using subdomains you'd need a strong team approach (Ghoere recruits his own players) because otherwise the small positions look like appetizers.

[Mojczak]

Well, the birthright holdings representing highly stratified society, a regent who actually "holds" a manor, more has the manor older, or the person who has bought the priviledges of exploiting it, under his hand, paying him a fee and granting him the regency. Unless the manor holder really is independent and rules his domain as he sees fit, all in legitimacy, paying no one's right but to the country's law. In those kind of campaigns you usually keep the big heavies as key npcs, to introduce DM plots and the like, unless you have a really devoted player who wants to make the effort of playing him by the story's stream.

[kgauck]

The domain system is so abstract and the descriptions of the cultures and realms so different, I think it represents anything you want it to, from a totally feudal arrangement to a fully absolute administrative monarchy.

[Mojczak]

Yes and no. It represents your authority over something that allows you to influence things and gets you money, there aren't ten thousands ways to do that. Even tho the cultural might differ, the result is the same. Holdings represents rule and influence. *and unless you are a mage you need to rule someone

[kgauck]

I would contend that there are ten thousand ways to do that. And ten thousand seems a little low, actually.

Take domain A, then move NPC 1 from treasurer to chancellor. That's an important difference. We now have two different conditions A1 and A2. Previously a good NPC with a high Administrate skill had applied it only to revenue and expense issues, now he might apply it to any test in the domain.

Who has the right to coin money?
Who has the right to hear appeals from courts in towns?
Who appoints the sheriffs (or equivalent)?
Does the king own the land in theory, or not?
is the law derived from Haelyn, or Avani? or Sera? or Erik? or Kriesha and Belinik?
What is the role of the people in legislation?
Which offices are elective? appointed? hereditary?

I could go on and on. Based on their unique history, the problems they confront, the people who staff their offices, and the legal system at play, its easy to make each domain look, feel, and function differently.

At the level of RP and GB, which are so abstract as represent anything at all, you can't tell the answers to these questions might change from place to place, but when you role play domain turns, or just interact with the domain, its clear there is a difference.

[Green Knight]

You'd want somewhere on the order of 50 players to want to open up sub-domains.

Or limit the area to say - Alamie vs Tournen

Generally a game should either focus on the sub-domains or the domains. Who wants to sign up to be 1/10th as strong as the next guy? Setting up a PBeM with 50-80 players and using subdomains you'd need a strong team approach (Ghoere recruits his own players) because otherwise the small positions look like appetizers.

Actually we had quite a bit of success with this one in the Ruins of Empire PbeM. Some domains were, by design or evolution, way more powerful than others. The introduction of Manor holdings allowed me (the DM) to break up major realms into sub-domains...so that a realm like Diemed would have several vassals from the start. Not all were open to players, most were NPC domains.

Yet several of the smaller domains offered (one domain, the County of Bellamie and its small guild comes to mind) some of the more rewarding game experiences. This of course this requires the player to have something other in mind than world conquest...but that was never a big factor in RoE anyway.

I think it all depends on DM/player communication about the focus of the game and what expectations the players have.

RoE is no longer running. I ended my Dm spree after turn 50 and the replacement Dm got ill and the game ended on turn 53.

[Mojczak]

This is a sad sad thing. I played assan for one turn(the turn were they butchered the whole goblin lot from markazor... and I've learned that my successor didn't quite continue with my succes, I had such beautiful ideas to make that the most succesful genocide campaign) before I had to deal with school issues and realised I couldn't commit to that game as much as I would have needed in the first few turns. By the way, is there a way to retrieve the data you were building for you home-brewed systems? I've looked throughout the site and couldn't find much of what used to be used.

[Mojczak]

Well, the plan if we can assemble a good dm team (something between 2 and 5 DMs) and twitch the system enough so that is makes things WAY interesting Id be willing to go recruit on wizards forums to see what happens.

So, so far we have ME as assured DM
possibly TheEladrin on some minor task, for limited to extended time.


Who else might be interested? Bjorn? I swear I'd be honored to Dm with your help...
KGauck? I sure together we could twitch over and over again...!

[Mojczak]

A couple of ideas for setting play.

The game starts with a Ducal Assembly or an assmebly of nobles, however the imperial city has been shut down and quarantined because there was a Plague going on and the Chamberlain ordered the imperial legions stationed outside to kill anyone who would leave the city, including the regents.

The Anuirean pantheon if proliferating. New temples are sprouting from here and there with "visionaries" claming one or other visions. Some local temples have burned people, claming them heretics and possessed and dangerous for the situation. But the problem gets worse when a temple head is himself affected by the said visions.

Civil strife both in ghoere and mhoried! A beautifully orchestred revolution is starting to grow in full fledged conflicts. The situation is critic for both regents.

Medoere. It is said that the high priestress has been infused with some of the moon's divine power for some time. Pilgrims from all over cerillia have been wondering to meet her. However, the clergy is uncertain as how to interpret that omen as mutilple constellations have changed and are morphing over the skies.

Gorgon. It is said that the gorgon was dispossed from his bloodline and as a result would have turned to stone, unable to move or cope with it's own powers. No one so far has attempted anything against the crown because reports are uncertain but it is true that attacks from markazor have been quite tranquil in comparison to the past few months.

A man as arisen on albiele islands, he claims himself to be "the lost Masetian King" and has supposedly taken over the control of the island from which he would be trying to... no one really knows.

Numerous young heirs, from 13 and under, from different duchies have disapeared from the map, leaving no trace of anything! Some people have been arrested as guilty but absolutly no child has been found whatsoever. Prince Avan himself has offered a more than decent bounty for whoever would get back his two sons!

It is said that the gorgon has never really killed michael roele, but rather used subterfuge to make him pass as such... and captured him and have him procude heirs that would serve HIM, Raesene. One of these possible heirs as surfaced in Mhoried, escaped would be more correct. The boy, of 11 years old, has striking features of the Roele. How he ended up being hit by daeric mhoried's hunting party is unkown. But the chamberlain himself has moved to meet the mhor to see that this story be resolved.

had a couple other but I have a blank. Will come back later.

[Thelandrin]

Prince Darien, not Prince Avan. Royal titles are coupled with first names or regnal titles, not with surnames.

I very much doubt that the Chamberlain would ever order the Imperial Legions to kill the Twelve Dukes, even if they were trying to break a supposed quarantine. If he even dared to assume that power, he might as well declare himself Emperor and, with the Dukes all present in the City, that might prove difficult.

Short of possibly a Dragon or two, the Gorgon is the hardest monster in Cerilia and the greatest challenge beneath the Gods. It would take a literal deus ex machina to divest the Gorgon.

[Mojczak]

Hey! It was speed idea storming. As for the gorgon. Hey! Guess what, that's exactly what the characters would think too... what the HECK would be bigger badder than the gorgon... tudum.

The chamberlain would indeed be in a most delicate position. But imagine that he would be responsible for the death of half of anuire, he wouldnt that either... The dukes simply are themselves quarantined inside the imperial citadel... and have to find a way to deal with their realm matters and, for some, try not to kill each other.

I am more thinking in terms of story than rules when I do these... then I adapt the rules and stick to them.

[kgauck]

Prince Darien, not Prince Avan. Royal titles are coupled with first names or regnal titles, not with surnames.


I second this. Referring to people by a surname is an insult.

[Mojczak]

Its under the assumption that the Prince in the setting might or might not still be Darien... oh well. Don't be so prude.

[Sorontar]

But isn't it Cornet Windsor in the British army? And what about Colin Robert Vaughan Campbell, 7th (and present) Earl Cawdor and 25th Thane of Cawdor. While his surname is Campbell, he isn't Earl Colin or Earl Campbell. He uses the "family name" which is sort-of a locative, Earl Cawdor.

[kgauck]

The royals in modern military service seek to be treated like everyone else and go by their last names.

Depending on the title, it has a customary style which describes how it is used. Cawdor is Colin's title and Earl Cawdor rather than Earl of Cawdor is its style. There are a lot of these. The newest Windsor is James, Viscount Severn.

It depends on the circumstances of the title's creation. Some titles are created from place names, others from last names (but the title is still a title). The word "Thatcher" in the style Baroness Thatcher of Kesteven in the County of Lincolnshire is part of a title.

Marquesses and Earls whose titles are based on place names normally use of, while those whose titles are based on surnames normally do not. Viscounts, Barons and Lords of Parliament do not use of.

Cawdor is a place name. The 1st Baron Cawdor was John Campbell. His son, John Frederick was eleveated to Earl Cawdor. Since the style of Cawdor as a barony was rank-title (rather than rank of title) it would appear that they continued to style it that way as an Earl.

Arthur Wellesley was made Viscount Wellington for his victories against the French in the Napoleonic wars in 1809. When he was elevated to Marquess, it was then styled Marquess of Wellington.

This is a particularly British issue, and generally not found elsewhere. However I often encounter the opposite problem with French titles, where English speakers often add the d' or de along with the title, referring to, de Valois, de Bourbon, instead of properly referring to them as Valois and Bourbon.

[Thelandrin]

Its under the assumption that the Prince in the setting might or might not still be Darien... oh well. Don't be so prude.
Then, if you want to get to that level of pickiness, just put "the ruler of Avanil" or "the Prince of Avanil".

Elizabeth II, Queen of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland and of Her other Realms and Territories, is never referred to as Queen Windsor, just like her husband is not Prince Mountbatten and her descendants are not Prince or Princess Windsor (or Mountbatten-Windsor). In this country (the UK), she is just "the Queen", for obvious reasons. She is also not Queen of England - England as a separate political unit ceased to exist upon the Act of Union in (I think) 1801.

[kgauck]

1 May 1707, England ceased to be with the Act of Union between the crowns of England and Scotland under the Stewart dynasty. This formed Great Britain.

1801 saw another Act of Union, when Ireland was integrated into a single United Kingdom.

[Thelandrin]

Thank you, Kenneth. I can never keep those two straight :) It's much like Stuart/Stewart - I can never remember which one is "more" Scottish, but Stuart seems to have won the contest to name the Scottish dynasty nowadays.

[Mojczak]

To get back to the original matter! I am very determined at making a very good and well developped campaign. I kind of am burning with the idea of having burning ideas. And I'd love to see that PBEM supported by the wiki community and the board community of birtright.net. But first! I need to know where I could find a good board, reliable and not entirely choked by publicity and spam that I could design to look nifty and sweet. After that I will set another thread to declare the openings. And if there are some of you who join me in the quest for greater roleplay, all the better! The number of DMs will determine the potency of the game.

Throw your advices.


OH! I need, AT least, one dm not as evil as I can be. Because I can be mucho pain and sometimes I just can be a bit too harsh ;P. Is there some moderate DM out there?

[Getters]

if i had the time to help i would but my time is vere limted.
ive co-dm one pbem and run one other so far.

[Mojczak]

Well, most obviously I will start small, if you ever have time feel free to drop by and say HI!

[Capricia]

if i had the time to help i would but my time is vere limted.
ive co-dm one pbem and run one other so far.

don't forget trying very hard to end up dead in at least one other as a player there John ;)

[Getters]

lol that too but then why i not surpise its mists death happions all the time.

[Mojczak]

What about a whole campaign based on Mieres and other island provinces? Small, full of political manipulation, ground for complete extermination, alien to most of anuire, prone to conflicts. Sounds like a potential for enriching game experience don't you agree?

[fbaker4]

http://www.myth-weavers.com/

Search for Birthright

Intro:

The invitation arrived at your manor in early spring; an invitation-only ball at the Imperial City of Aniure at the midmonth of Deismir. While you’re initially unsure why you – not a regent, not in-line to inherit – Spring and Summer are the seasons of Balls. With some looking into it, you determine that it is indeed a ‘second-tier’ Ball, specifically for the purpose of introducing some of the ‘minor’ members of the important families of the realm to each other. While the Imperial Chamberlain’s office organizes many of these such events, the first few of the season are typically excellent & great fun – an opportunity to see members of your own extended family, rivals of your family and personal interests, as well as highly suitable marriage prospects. Business deals of commerce and marriage are as likely to occur as dancing and dinner, and information flows as freely as wine…

And your invitation has an additional note, penned in a different hand –

“As well, please accept my request that you make some time to meet personally with me, on the day before the first feast. Simply send one retainer to me as you arrive, and they will be given the particulars.”

It’s signed in the hand of the Chamberlain himself.