Congratulations and a few Quest

[Daniel McSorley]

>1. Establishing a level 1 holding:
>
>Is there any way to 'encroach' on another ruler's territory, without using
>the aggravate action (twice, I think?), thus destroying ALL of their

Well, it's always aggravated me, but the action is actually agitate.
And no, I don't believe there is and existing mechanic for reducing a
holding by only one level.
>3. Introducing blooded characters to a domain
>
>I have read a lot of recent posts where DM's have said that they let their
>players adventure and then introduced them to regency after they get to
>level 4 or so. How do the characters become regents, other than being
>simply next in line for the throne? How is this handled when you (intend)
>have multiple PC's as regents (ie. do they all suddenly get appointed?)?
>
They could, in no particular order:
- -overthrow the ruler
- -be designated the heir
- -create a new domain, it only costs GB not RP
- -be made the new rulers of a conquored land by the conquorer, ie Avanil
conquors Tuornen, they were loyal suppporters of his effort, he rewards them
with some or all the provinces he conquored, as his vassals of course.
It's late, so I can't think of any others. I'm sure everybody will get
the ones I missed.

Daniel McSorley
mcsorley.1@osu.edu

[c558382@showme.missouri.]

On Thu, 15 Jan 1998, Simon Graindorge wrote:

> 1. Establishing a level 1 holding:
>
> Is there any way to 'encroach' on another ruler's territory, without
> [. . .] destroying ALL of their holdings? [. . .] It seems strange to me
> that there is no way (unless I have misread the rules) to reduce
> somebody's holding level (by one) so that you could establish a level 1
> holding. I agree that it should be difficult to do, and obviously the
> larger the existing holding level the more difficult it will be. Any
> comments are (very) much appreciated.
>

I too have had some problem with the all or nothing character of the
contest action. Power is gradually whittled away by one side or another.
Second, nature abhores a vacume. There should never be a time where
holdings are vacant. Holdings might be held by smaller figures in the
collapse of greater power, but networks don'y dissolve, they *devolve*
unto more local authorities. Clearly the collapse of the Carolingian
Empire demonstrate how holdings lost to the center (the successors of
Charlemagne) were not simply empty, but rather immediatly assumed by local
lords. The same thing happened after the battle of Mohacs (1526) in which
Hungary was partitioned. In BR terms, the regent died with no presumed
heir, his regency was lost, and his holdings up for grabs. There was no
viable heir recognized by the Hungarian nobility to assume the crown in
Louis' place. What happened was the local nobles assumed the law holdings
and collected regency in penny-packets. Three central entities began
immediatly attracting these nobles to them: the victorious Turks who had
won the battle of Mohacs, Ferdinand of Habsburg, and John Zapolya the
viovode of Transylvania. Christian Hungarians were not siding with the
Turk, but where the Turks had control (the middle third of the country)
they could establish holdings and build them up. John Zapolya, as viovode
of Transylvania, was an important Hungarian noble. He was therefore the
national candidate for those nobles who did not wish to support either the
Turks or the Habsburgs, but held out for a Hungarian king rather than
incorporation in a larger empire. Zapolya's father in law was also king
of Poland, and thus able to loan him GB and RP. Ferdinand's grandfather,
the Emperor Maximilian, had conducted another of his famous marraige
alliances with Hungary-Bohemia before his death (it was Max's marriages
that gave Charles V his great empire). Ferdinand married the Hungarian
princess Anne Jagellon, while his sister Mary (Habsburg) married Louis II
Jagellon, king of Hungary and Bohemia. With Louis' death, his widowed
queen, Mary, and his sister, Anne, became advocates of Ferdinand's
candidacy. Getting GB and RP from his brother Charles V, Holy Roman
Emperor and King of Spain. What happened is a shift, back and forth
between Ferdinand and Zapolya. While many law holdings were not held by
either Ferdinand or Zapolya, they were not absent, but held by local
nobles. At various times, after this battle, or that bribe, or such and
such a pronouncement by prominant bishops, holdings drifted back and
forth.

Rather than the all or nothing character of the present contest system.
Contest actions should be for one holding at at time.

It should still be possible to use the contest action to neutralize a
group of holdings as per p. 52 of the rulebook, but should cost 2RP and
1GB per level of the holding suspended. This would represent pogroms
against enemies of the crown. If the people hated the attacked regent,
this would be the only cost. But, if the people were merely indifferent
to them, it should also drop a level of loyalty in the province.

Kenneth Gauck
c558382@showme.missouri.edu

[Samuel Weiss]

Agitate instead of aggravate, yes. But the action to destory anothers
holding is Contest. Once to neutralize it and make it unusable until ruled
by the owner. A second time to destroy it. Although oddly enough, instead
of destroying it you could technically have a priest invest you with the
holding. It would probably cost a heck of a lot of regency, but you would
get the holding aaat full strength. This is something I have wondered about
and would like to see cleared up.

Samwise

[Neil Barnes]

On Thu, 15 Jan 1998, Daniel McSorley wrote:
> >I have read a lot of recent posts where DM's have said that they let their
> >players adventure and then introduced them to regency after they get to
> >level 4 or so. How do the characters become regents, other than being
> >simply next in line for the throne? How is this handled when you (intend)
> >have multiple PC's as regents (ie. do they all suddenly get appointed?)?
>
> They could, in no particular order:
> -overthrow the ruler
> -be designated the heir

"You have a strawberry birthmark in the shape of text reading 'I am the
long lost heir to the throne of Aftane' - this means that you are the
missing Jarl of Halskapa. Congratulations"

neil

[Herald Williams]

At 10:25 AM 1/15/98 -0500, you wrote:
>Agitate instead of aggravate, yes. But the action to destory anothers
>holding is Contest. Once to neutralize it and make it unusable until ruled
>by the owner. A second time to destroy it. Although oddly enough, instead
>of destroying it you could technically have a priest invest you with the
>holding. It would probably cost a heck of a lot of regency, but you would
>get the holding aaat full strength. This is something I have wondered about
>and would like to see cleared up.
>
>Samwise

In the campaign I ran in early 1996, I decided that the regent doing a
contest action could choose to contest just a particular number of levels.
For example, if one regent had a law(4) and another regent wanted to
contest, rather than contesting the whole law(4), he could contest just
one (or two or three) levels. The cost was not reduced for doing this
though and the "victim" regent's full holding was still counted in his
favor for affecting the "attacker's" die roll.

[Blastin]

In a message dated 98-01-14 23:31:03 EST, you write:

>
Well, this type of introduction of characters to regents is my favorite
method, and I've done it twice now, so I'll offer my two cents.
I like having the characters start out as "regular" adventurers and working
into the realm game for a few reasons. I think that players that have their
characters start out as regular adventurers and then "graduate" into regents
feel a better connection to the area that they now are responsable for. I also
think that the new regents feel more connected to their domains because they
worked for them and had to prove themselves ready and able to rule. Also, the
regular adventuring days gives the characters plenty of time to make
connections with the "little people" of the champaign area.
Ok, those were the reasons, now for the "how to" suggestions. I would advise
you to first take a look at the domain areas that the players want to rule in.
Look at who rules the area and what their motivations for and commitment to
ruling are. Is the regent that you hope to replace with a pc the "reluctant
ruler" who would gladly hand over rule to someone who was capable? Is the
current regent an evil dictator that just seems to be begging to be
overthrown? Is she an aged but beloved ruler who is looking for her next heir?
you get the idea. Look at the present regent and determine what would be the
best way for him or her to step down. And remember that the present ruler is
probably not going to hand over the regency to someone who isn't "proven" to
be a good prospect (or, in the case of a dictator, the PEOPLE won't support
someone who hasn't proven themselves NOT to be another dictator wanna be).
Once you know what the circumstances are that will lead to the replacement of
the present regent, place the pc in the position to be the regent's (or the
people's) choice of heir. Gear the first few adventurers so that the pcs come
to the attention of the present regent and the people. Make the pcs popular
(or even infamous) with the people in power and the commoners through the
first few adventures. Play up the "local hero" bit so that when the pc gets
handed the regency it seems logical.
Those first few adventures are also a great time for the pcs to meet the
other powerful people in the area as relativly unthreatening non-regents, and
the players can use these times to pick up helpful info if they pay attention.
Ok, done rambling.... Hope that made some sense. Simon, if you want the
exact details of how I did it in my campaign, just e-mail me and I'll be glad
ta help.
Blastin